Game On — Monopoly

Peter, Pastor Zach, and Tyler continue the Game On series by connecting Monopoly with the story of Haman in Esther. They explore how pride, comparison, and the pursuit of more can steal our contentment, and how humility and trust in God's bigger plan lead to lasting freedom.

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Transcript

Cold Open And Host Hijack

SPEAKER_00 0:04

Well hello. Oh, sorry. Are you my bad? Go ahead. Jeez, I had so much momentum in my mind. Well, forget it. Welcome to Just keep going, Zach.

SPEAKER_02 0:18

Beyond Sunday. I'm not the host today, but I'm a guest that willingly is hijacking this show. Today I've got two guests on with me. Go ahead and share your names.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

What else is new? Here's Zach just trying to take over. Well, I was asked to host this. My name is Peter Bay, and uh Dina is actually trying out for a reality TV show. Oh, nice. And uh that's not true, but if it was, what reality TV show would Dina most be trying out for? Oh no more hijacking.

SPEAKER_01 0:51

Um, so this is Tyler from the Fremont campus. Hello, everyone. Um, I feel like she would do, would you count like the extreme makeover home edition as a reality show? Absolutely. I feel like she would kill it at that. Yes, like being like as the one going into the house to remake it.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

Not the person with the real trashy house.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

I my guess is that she does not have a trashy. My guess is that she'd be really good at making houses nice.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

That's a great poll, actually.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

You're you're still so mad at me for my judgment first moment, I can tell. I I was really happy about my performance there. I think Dina, she's a huge fan of Survivor, but in a similar way, I think she would be on the summer reality show Big Brother. That's an another great poll, but why? Why? Because I feel like she is super personable, social. I think she would have fun with the games. I think she would get along with the people in the house. And yeah, I think I think she'd do pretty well at it. Yeah, well, those are great options. As the host of today's podcast, what do you think, Peter?

SPEAKER_00 1:56

Yeah, I'm so glad you asked and you acknowledged my hostmanship. And uh believe it or not, I haven't I I thought about the question, but I didn't think about the answer. And so I'm going to go with my one

Dina’s Secret Talents And National Days

SPEAKER_00 2:10

of the OGs. I've never actually heard her sing. Um, and I don't know if she has some crazy talent, but it's been around not quite as old as America's uh as uh um American Idol, but America's got talent. Oh, nice. Yeah, I mean she's got such uh electric personality, she would be able to do something and get the crowd on her side. Absolutely, and not it wouldn't be unanimous. Like, I don't think she'd be golden buzzer because like the skill wouldn't like be so incredible that because we would know about it if it's golden ticket talent, but she'd be so lovable that the judges would have a tough time saying no.

SPEAKER_02 2:49

And it might be her talent, it might be like knowing what national holidays are more than anybody else.

SPEAKER_00 2:56

Just name a date and she could tell you what the net the national holiday is.

SPEAKER_01 3:00

There was a podcast one time for you, faithful listener, you'll remember this where Dina said one of her special talents is being able to know the number of people that I need to be fed in a group and know exactly what food to order and how much. Wow. That would really go well on America's Got Talent.

SPEAKER_00 3:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

That's brilliant.

SPEAKER_02 3:18

Did you know that today is national fajita day?

SPEAKER_01 3:23

Oh, there you go.

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 3:25

Dina, how many fajitas need to be ordered for a group of 60?

SPEAKER_02 3:29

It's also National Couples Day, National Ice Cream Pie Day, Bad Poetry Day, National Mail Order Catalog Day, Pinot Noir Day, and Never Give Up Day. Yeah. So let's according to Google.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

Let's go with the first one you mentioned. Are you fajita dudes? Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Oh, the sizzle? Are you come on? Yeah, and the production value of that food product is wonderful.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

Presentation is high level.

SPEAKER_00 3:53

Yes, it is. With the tortillas in the aluminum foil that stay hot. Come on. In the aluminum foil or the little like round case, like the dumpling case. Oh, they have the little case. Either one. Either one. Alright. Do you go steak, chicken, or shrimp? Or combo. I like that.

SPEAKER_02 4:11

Yeah, I usually combo it.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Thai. Um, I'm a fan of all Mexican food and any shape, combination. Spices are delicious, sauce, cheese, meat is delicious.

SPEAKER_00 4:21

That's wonderful. Tortilla. Yeah, I I'm gonna go on the hard room to say that I am anti-fajita. Yeah, I knew you would be. Uh and simply because it's so expensive and it takes up so much room on the table. I think whatever people order, I'm like, oh, here they go. Like, that's why you're a fajita guy, Zach. You hijack the podcast, you hijack the table space. I I that's mean, number one.

SPEAKER_02 4:44

Number two, my larger point is that I actually think fajitas are generally a pretty good deal comparative to the rest of the stuff on there. It's like maybe three to four dollars more than a regular entree,

The Great Fajita Debate

SPEAKER_02 4:55

but the amount of food you can usually make it into two meals. Sometimes they have a fajitas for two, which is an even better value.

SPEAKER_01 5:01

I was just gonna ask if you anyway. Because if you can share with someone at your table, then the overall table space makes a little bit more sense.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

And that's why Peter wouldn't know about it. He doesn't like to share.

SPEAKER_00 5:12

Oh my gosh, that's the point. I didn't realize this was actually what I like to do is I like to not order because I grew up with such little money that I I love to not order and then just finish whatever's but then last time we went out for like a family meal, Carissa and I had a heart to heart about that because she's like, I don't like it when you do that because I feel like I need to share food with you. And I don't want to share. Yeah, and she was like, No, I want to eat what I ordered because I ordered it on purpose, and I was like, Oh no, this is tough because I still don't want to spend that much money, and I would rather order nothing and save money.

SPEAKER_01 5:48

Props to her for bringing that up though.

SPEAKER_00 5:50

Yeah, it was a great, it was great for me to know. So, yeah, I still I still held with the game plan, but she did not share. She's like, I told you I wasn't gonna share. I was like, I know. The kids never eat all their food.

SPEAKER_02 6:01

Right, yeah. And as a dad, you are like a vacuum cleaner for your kids' extra food at restaurants.

SPEAKER_01 6:07

That was me with the kids' snow cones last night at back to school night. It's like they they wanted snow cones, but of course the smallest size is way too big for any of them. Yes. So I finished three snow cones.

SPEAKER_00 6:17

Did you get any of it on your shirt?

SPEAKER_01 6:19

No, a tone on my tongue and lips, but none on my shirt. Golly, that's on the sort of solemn.

SPEAKER_02 6:24

I was wondering why your lips were blue when you came into church today.

SPEAKER_00 6:28

Well, anyway, that's not a perfect tie to this message series that we're on. But we have been in game on, and uh we've we've been using different games. Uh we've used Pokemon, Stardew Valley, and then this week we use one of the most divisive board games of all time. Pastor Greg even said that there was a someone was shot uh from a disagreement in this board game, uh, and that is Monopoly. Originally Monopolist is what I learned. And then some guy stole the the idea and took all the money and gave none of the credit, which is the Monopoly way of doing things. Really? It is in the spirit of Monopoly, he did a great job. And so Monopoly, one, um, the first part is do you guys play Monopoly? Does it cause fights? And then two, um, I would love to hear like how how Monopoly connected well to this message specifically, like what stood out to you.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Um, yeah, so I put I grew up playing Monopoly specifically with my brother during the summer. He's four years older and four years smarter, so I rarely won a game. Um, and those games took forever. Um, Zach, you you're at the Fremont campus on Sunday, and so you you you told them that you and your boys have kind of grown to be like very efficient in your playing Monopoly. Yeah, we were not at that point as uh kids growing up. So they we're talking like three, four, five-hour games, and you do it like once every two months, and then you realize why you don't do it. Um, have you guys heard of Monopoly Deal, the card deal?

SPEAKER_00 8:03

Yes, love it.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

That's a great way to capture the spirit of Monopoly quickly. And even our kids, Isla's 11, Theo's eight, like they they they they know exactly how to play, they you know know the strategy, um, and it's a little less um domineering of a game than pure Monopoly.

SPEAKER_02 8:22

Right. Yeah. Yes, we do play Monopoly. And I would say when it's just me and the two boys, like we don't fight much because we have a very similar value estimation of what everything on the board is worth. At one point, Nathan looked up the statistical probabilities and the best properties to have and created the uh basically trades that are fair, and we kind of all work with that. So I would say the three of us got to play pretty efficiently, knew what was best, and then when we had guests come in, that's where they'd be fighting because they wouldn't have any idea of the system we'd created. And uh outside of scatteries, it's probably the the most fight fightful type of a game that there is.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

So amongst your family, you're good. It's when you have guests in your home that you fight them. Correct.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

Wow, monopoly or not even Allison is one of those people that plays by different rules, too. And that's the frustrating piece, is one day she decided to start trading things and give really good deals, which is ridiculous. And then the other family rule, we have a couple of them, and I'm always fascinated by people's family rules, but we when you collect go or hit go, uh, instead of collecting 200, you get 300. That's a Zender rule, and then also free parking, we would throw an extra 500 in free parking every time. And in this particular game, when it was already kind of getting out of whack and feeling like unfair because of her deals which she was making, which were really good for all of us, but really upsets the game system. She won free parking and then decided to be generous and give the money away. And that essentially was the end of the game. This is stupid when somebody has a generous act in Monopoly, it ruined the game.

SPEAKER_00 10:05

That is that is so wild. So, gentlemen, connect how how did Monopoly connect to the Esther narrative? Uh, what stood out to you broad level?

SPEAKER_01 10:16

Yeah, Pastor Gray made the connection uh pretty clearly. We spent a lot of time this

Money Stories And Sharing Food

SPEAKER_01 10:20

week on the character of Heyman, who's been introduced a little bit the last couple weeks, but um in the same way that the the goal of Monopoly is to get it all, and that you could have you could have 18 of the properties on the board, but if you don't have those final two, I don't know if 20 is total, but you know what I'm saying. Um the the only way that you end the game is if you get everything. And that's exactly where Heyman was. Um and so as I was writing the connect group guide um earlier the uh earlier this week on Sunday night, um it was you know, I was I was thinking about that with um uh where we are in terms of contentment and um how often is it the way of the world to I need it all and I will only be content if I have it all. And then ironically, it was Heyman's downfall. He already he already had nearly everything, but it was his downfall because he insisted on getting absolutely more, which was Mordecai's down, uh he wanted Mordecai dead, and then it was it was that that actually caused him to die.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

Yeah, similar. It's amazing when you look at how much Heyman has. I mean, outside of the king, he had every he was the highest up, he had everything, um, and really had a lot of the people in the support too, except for one guy, Mordecai. So you can have almost everything and still be discontent. And that that is the game of Monopoly. You can have boardwalk and park place and hotels on everything, but if you don't have that one brown Baltic Avenue property that you can get for 60 bucks, like you're not content. It's like how how do I how do I get that? I gotta get that. And so anyway, I thought that was the a pretty good tie-in of just like, and then the personal side of that as well. Obviously, it's a board game, it's a real story that happens centuries before Jesus, but how much God gives to all of us, and yet we can still be discontent and look at the one thing that I don't have as opposed to focusing on the 99 things God has given me.

SPEAKER_00 12:21

Yeah. Okay, so we're gonna do something a little different. I'm gonna give you your assignment, and then you I'm gonna give you time to answer these questions. And so, Zach, for the the people listening who don't know the narrative of Esther, um, especially in regards to Heyman, I would love for you, you're going to give us, we're gonna go with a one-minute summary of like flying through the first part and then really grabbing on to Heyman and like the whole book of Esther, but specific focus on Heyman. Yes. Yeah, because this message got got into Heyman more than any of the others will.

SPEAKER_02 13:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:01

So you're gonna have one minute to do that, and then uh Tyler, you're gonna have one minute to make the connection of how the ego and pride that Heyman had, how it how he's not alone, how we bear that and how it gets in the way of us and God. Okay. So Zach.

SPEAKER_01 13:25

Assignment received.

SPEAKER_00 13:26

I got my I got my clock already up. You he's got his clock.

SPEAKER_02 13:29

As the host, I brought it up already.

SPEAKER_00 13:31

This is so exciting. This is a uh this is a beyond Sunday first. So on your mark, get set, go.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

The king is named Xerxes, and his wife Vashti. Oh, I should hit start. His wife Vashti won't show up and impress a lot of the nobles, so he invites a bunch of women to like a bachelor type of situation, and Esther finds favor and becomes

Game On Series And Why Monopoly

SPEAKER_02 13:55

the queen. And she's a queen, she's a Jew, but there's another guy named Haman, who's a high official in Xerxes' ranks. He's got nearly everything except one guy named Mordecai, won't bow down to him, won't like him, and so Haman gets all angry and fussy and starts talking to his friends, and his friends tell him, You should set up a pole and you should kill, you should impale Mordecai on this pole. And so he does that. That was he was really happy about his poll that he set up. Little did he know that Mordecai and Esther were working on a plot with God behind them to get Xerxes on their side. That as Xerxes started to uncover this, he realized that Mordecai had actually that Haman had actually kind of screwed him over a little bit. And so, in a plot twist that's crazy, Haman actually was ordered to be impaled on the poll that he set up by King Xerxes, and that's a pretty awesome thing.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

There you go. One minute. One minute. Is there any revisions that you want to add now that you're mentioning? Oh, yeah, tons.

SPEAKER_02 14:51

I want to add a lot of detail. Uh, I stumbled on my words once or twice, but um, the gist of it is there. Uh and Heyman, uh, I I gave this joke. I think it's pretty funny. I think our Beyond Sunday listeners will find this very humorous because it's a very niche group we're talking to here. As we're talking about games, you could argue that Heyman became the first hangman.

SPEAKER_00 15:14

Heyman, hangman. Anyway. Very good. And that's where it comes from. Hangman. It is yeah, it comes from this.

SPEAKER_01 15:23

Breaking news on the Beyond Sunday podcast.

SPEAKER_02 15:26

So now Ty. I didn't mean to monopolize the time. Well done.

SPEAKER_01 15:31

Reset your timer there. Yep. So you're gonna reset it. We've got one minute.

SPEAKER_00 15:36

One minute for Tyler, pride and even go.

SPEAKER_01 15:40

Um, yeah, so with Heyman, there was this sense of like even like what he had was not enough. Um, he was very prone to comparison. Um, and even if Mordecai did not give him the praise and honor that he felt he deserved, if he did not have all of it, he felt like he had none of it. Um, and so what what what do we fall into? I think one is we can very much fall into comparison. And so if someone else has more or different than us, we feel like we don't have anything at all. Um, Haman is also very offendable. Um, and and it really is just because he's kind of he just kind of resents Mordecai. Um and so how often are we um maybe we overreact to things that we shouldn't overreact to and we don't handle things with grace we should? Um and then finally, pride is always going to focus on ourselves, and Jesus is the one who's always pointing us outside of ourself to God and to neighbor. And one more second, and I'm done.

SPEAKER_00 16:41

Nice. Well done. That's that was excellent. Can you guys think of times in your life where pride and ego got in the way of your relationship with God or others? I can't think of any permission. Awesome, Zach.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

As his brother, maybe, maybe, maybe in that maybe in that answer potentially. Oh gosh, pride and ego. Yeah, I mean, can I think of times in my life where that has what was the question? Been a part of my life?

SPEAKER_00 17:10

Yeah, and and how it's gotten in the way uh between you and God or you and and the people he's put around you.

SPEAKER_02 17:17

Yeah, I think sometimes when I feel like I'm, I don't know, kind of being treated unfairly or uh just kind of yeah, treated unfairly. I'll go with that. Uh I can kind of really quickly uh if someone I feel like is treating me that way, just kind of like in my own head, like be thinking of all the reasons why they're wrong and why I'm right and defend myself. And I realized I can kind of play the victim card sometimes a lot. And and so that's one where I'm trying to check my pride and recognize and realize that uh there are parts of my life and even as a disciple that tries to grow, uh, there are still things I need to clean up. There's still decisions that I make that are wrong, there's still sin in my life that's prevalent. And rather than kind of like hearing someone that I feel like's being unfair to me, I should receive what what they're saying and not go to jump to defend myself or make myself out a victim, but rather recognize like, yeah, I am still a broken, sinful person. And I'm not because I'm a pastor or because I've done X, Y, or Z, uh, I am not immune to um having my own faults and difficulties and and trying to really press into that so that I can become a healthier person.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Um yeah, I think where I feel this most is when it comes to um like

Family Rules That Break Monopoly

SPEAKER_01 18:45

people pleasing and the need for approval or the desire for approval. Tim Keller wrote a book um um a while back, he's with the Lord now, he called the freedom of self-forgetfulness. And uh and kind of this idea of when when when we are fully embracing our identity in Christ, we're actually freed from the the the need to feel that sense of validation from others, or like we like and that that's ultimately what where pride will blind us. And pride is um, I think if you were to look like the seven deadly sins, it's gonna be the first one. And some people just associate pride and sin as one and the same because it's it's pulling you away from God. And what is what does James and Peter say? God, um, God opposes the proud, but he gives grace to the humble. And as I look at myself, I'm like, yep, and any given day I can be accounted as the proud, in which case God is opposed to where I'm at. And then when I choose the way of humility, um I'm in the I'm in the best position to receive God's grace. Um, and so it it always comes back to knowing who I am in Jesus. And then out of that, actually getting myself out of the way, just thinking about myself less, forgetting about myself because God has fully cared for me in Jesus, and now I can be fully free to love and serve my neighbor.

SPEAKER_00 20:05

I remember when we first launched Northwest, um, the first couple months, it's like my whole attitude rose and fell on the attendance of the previous Sunday. And early on with the church plant, that's the question you get the most. It's not like um, any new people who have you met? It's it's like, how is how is attendance on Sunday? And I was just so some Sundays it'd be like, we are awesome. And then the next one it'd be low, and I'd be like, oh, and people would say, Well, what do you think's going on? Do you think like it's not going well? And I was like, I don't know, maybe, maybe it's not, maybe I'm a failure. Um, and so I met with a uh a guy who's been a mentor for me and and explained what was going on in my mind, and um, and he kind of laughed at me and and he said, Do you think the success of this site's really gonna depend on you? And and that was a really good reframing. Um, and then he gave me a new target. He said, Let's let's come up with a new number. What do we want to target? And so what we landed on at that lunch was the number one. Um, one new person each week. And let's celebrate that. And who's that new person? And who can you invite? And everyone can be involved with one new person. But that was really important for me because it helped release the the pridefulness of a great Sunday's on me and uh a lower attendance Sunday is is a bad Sunday. Um, and it instead it put the focus back on God and his people and introducing one more person to God. Um, and so that that really stood out to me. Now, Esther and and Mordecai, they were in a pretty tough spot, and there's this old line, Zach, that your dad years and years ago in a message and We even had like a t shirt. Your setback is your setup for your comeback. And how as um originally spoken by Uma Uma Uk Pai.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

Your setup is your set your setback is your setup for your comeback.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 22:18

Dad likes to say it.

SPEAKER_01 22:19

Well on the second try.

SPEAKER_00 22:20

On the second try. That's right. And so like Esther and Mordecai, they had setback after setback and it looked pretty scary. But yet they proceeded and um saw God

Haman’s Hunger For More

SPEAKER_00 22:35

at work. How do you see this in your life and then in the life of a church leader?

SPEAKER_01 22:42

Yeah, you know what I think about is our field of view and our perspective is so limited. And then of course God's perspective and field of view is limitless. Um and there's I think there's something, there's an anxious part of each of us that really wants to see the full picture. And at least on this side of eternity, we likely will not, we were not seeing it now, we likely never will. Um, and so this is just where understanding he is the creator and we are his creatures, and just like, God, you are the potter, we're the clay. And that that basic part of submission of like, I'm gonna trust you as our heavenly father. Um, and we see that with Esther and Mordecai. Like Mordecai did not, and Greg drew this out on Sunday, he did not like force the situation for King Xerxes to become aware of how he had prevented the assassination earlier in the book, right? He could have he could have done all these things to take matters in his own hands. Instead, he just did he chose quiet faithfulness. It's like God is my defender. And and it's just through these like strange events that Xerxes is like, I can't sleep. Come read me the book. And he's like, wait a second, did did Mordecai ever get honored for the good thing that he did? Um, and and it's it's not this promise that absolutely everything is gonna work out perfectly and we're never gonna have trials. No, on this side of new creation, Jesus said, in this world you will have trouble, you will have trials. But through it all, at the end of the time, we are going to see the the handiwork of God's weaving of grace throughout the tapestry of time that we're gonna look back and say, Wow, God, look at everything that you've done. And then any taste and glimpse we get of that on this side, great. But it all just comes back to trust. Like, God, you got this.

SPEAKER_02 24:41

Yeah, well said. And I yeah, I think that's just life. I think we all want everything of uh all of the parts of our lives kind of up and up and to the right, you know. But life is a uh series of uh incremental progress. You might have two steps forward and one step backward, and and I think that God uses that. And if it was all just up and to the right, I actually think people would cry out far less to God. Uh, I think it is in the setbacks that we relate to him. I so I yeah, I remember several times in my life. One I'm thinking of now is that seminary, uh just um uh feeling like I preached a really good, you know, I was on Vicarage, so it was probably like the fifth or sixth sermon I ever gave. Felt like the best sermon I ever preached up to that point, which again is not that impressive, but and I just remember a seminary professor was there and um called me into his office, I don't know, a couple days later, and I thought he was gonna be like, oh, so good, Zach, so good. And instead it was like, hey, that was pretty terrible. And he he pointed out a few things to me, and especially like my he didn't like the way I handled the law and gospel. And anyway, it felt like he made it uh his I don't know, um, agenda to make sure uh he that I didn't graduate and had some professors stand up for me. Um, and and so that felt like a setback and ended up having to take another class and slow down a little bit before I got out. But I think it made me a stronger preacher. Um as I looked back at it, it he taught me a couple of things even through that, and we were able to reconcile. Um I'd moved on from it a long, long time ago, but we actually were able to reconcile and talk about it just a couple months ago, uh, which is pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 26:26

So yeah, thanks for sharing that. Yeah, and sometimes it's things that that happen to us, um, and uh and sometimes it's things that we cause. Uh I think about one of them for us is when we had our house fire in 2017, and it house fires are so wild, uh, and it took most of our house. And we, you know, you we woke up the next morning. I didn't have any clothes. I went and grabbed a pair of swim trunks uh from my father-in-law and his Scott Frost frost warning t-shirt. And I went to Walmart to start over. And that was such a surreal place to be. But then what happened over the next weeks and months was person after person um calling, asking what we needed, or just giving us giving things. And uh it was a I've never had and may never have again a season of such personal generosity from

Pride, Comparison, And Approval

SPEAKER_00 27:25

God and his people that I did in that season. I would not recommend a house fire, but by the time it was all said and done, I was like, holy cow, how blessed am I? So that's something that happened to me. But there's also been things that um things that I have just messed up that have really taught me, like what you said. Uh for me in college, uh, I played trombone and I sang. At the same time? And well, yeah, it's pretty incredible.

SPEAKER_02 27:56

Wow, this sounds like America's got talent right after Dina.

SPEAKER_00 28:00

Well, I was supposed to be playing trombone for this alumni concert, and we had rehearsal early in the morning on a Saturday, and in college, early it's like 8 a.m. And I slept in and I missed my alarm and I wasn't there for the rehearsal, and I did not get another trombone uh feature in a choral song until my fifth year. And I would go to these auditions and I would like crush the audition, and the next guy wouldn't it would be like just struggling, and they'd and the director kept giving it to the other people. Um, but it was a huge lesson for me of like my actions matter, and it was a setback, but I wasn't late again and uh I did the work better. And so, Tyler, does something come to mind, a setback that uh set you up for a comeback?

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Um I mean, I I I guess the place to start is um I I just feel richly incredibly blessed, like where the the parents the Lord gave me, the uh family growing up, educational opportunities, this church family. Um when uh this would have been January of last year. Uh I was out uh Ali and I serving a church in Connecticut. Shout out to any uh friends listening to the Beyond Sunday podcast from Westport, Connecticut. And uh we we knew that there were kind of some financial realities that were you know we're kind of the train was gonna hit the station at some point. Uh we weren't totally sure, and of course, trusting God. So it was a Monday and got called into the pastor's office and and he he shares, hey, um I'm gonna be taking a call this summer. And um uh and so things you know, things are gonna change and that sort of thing. We're shocked about that. Then find out that same afternoon that um our best friends um were also going to be moving. And then the next day find out that there were uh desires for for me to step into a pastoral road role there. And then the day after that, get a call from Pastor Greg that says, Hey, we've watched this Fremont campus, praying about it, your name keeps coming up, could we chat? And I guess it's a different kind of a setback, but the the sense of God throwing everything up in the air at once, not really knowing what was gonna happen, and also knowing that the status quo was gonna end. I think that was probably the thing that was most um disorienting at that point, that like there wasn't an option to stay um and keep going the way things were. It was it had to be a change. Um, and then the way that things shook out, um, uh you guys might be surprised to hear we moved to Fremont.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

Yeah. So did you know that, Peter?

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Welcome to the area.

SPEAKER_01 31:04

Yeah. Um, but God's been so incredibly gracious. And and even just in his providence, even the church in Connecticut, amazing new pastor who received received a call last or writer, yeah, uh accepted the call. And he's been there for he'll be a year this September, and the church is thriving. They're doing great. Um, and and so that just seeing, okay, we would have never written the story this way. And of course, we're still in the middle of the story, but for the pieces that we've seen, we can say, Yep, God, your fingerprints are all over it.

SPEAKER_02 31:34

And by the way, stories that don't have setbacks are lame. Every good story, every good movie has incredible setbacks and typically comebacks. And and I think as Christians, you know, we we deal with people and listeners are probably some of these people where there's always setbacks. You talk to people that can't have a child, and you talk to people that lost their job, and it's like, ah, I don't understand, I don't know. And then all of a sudden, a job, a door opens, and it's a greater job they ever could imagine. And a child comes or an adoption comes, and it's like the greatest thing they could ever imagine. And there's so many instances where when you can actually see the whole picture, you're like, wow, God, I saw you in that. Now there's some times where you don't get to see that, and that's frustrating and that's hard, and that's where our faith has to come in even more of like, whatever I don't see, I do have to trust that the author and finisher of all of this has got a better story than I could ever think, ask, or imagine, even if I can't see it. And yet we have enough times that we can look back and say, Man, I see that. And that's the story of Esther. Like, this is in my in my mind, the most incredible flip of a setback into a comeback, where the guy that built the pole to kill Mordecai ends up getting impaled on it. And it even says it this way in chapter nine, verse uh, what is it, in the verse one, that they were gonna do this by the way, and kill Mordecai on it and celebrate on that day, the 12th month, the month of Adar, um, and on this third day or whatever, 13th day of it, they were gonna celebrate that. But that was actually the day that they celebrated, and it says that the tables were turned, and now the Jews got the up, like the tables are turned, the weapons are flipped, and like that's the amazing piece about God in Esther, especially, is just when you look at it from a overall, you're like, that's a one of the greatest stories, right? Like, I mean, that's a move. Uh we did, we we saw it together in Branson, didn't we? At the sight and sound, I was like, Man, that's that's an incredible story. Like, that's cinematic right there.

SPEAKER_00 33:38

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:39

Well, there's that great

Setbacks That Become Comebacks

SPEAKER_01 33:40

verse at the end of Genesis that Joseph speaks, uh, you know what the enemy intended for evil, God worked for good, and kind of that that active redemption that God works. And I thought Greg did a great job of drawing the New Testament connection. That quite literally, Jesus grew up in the shadow of the cross. Like that, that's what the Romans wanted. That Rome, the, those, the, the Roman crucifixion was meant to send a message. You cross us, here, here is what your penalty will be. And so if you're traveling from Samaria to Jerusalem, you are going to see crosses on the side. And and it is what what the what the enemy meant for evil, meant for destruction, was actually the enemy's destruction when Jesus assumed death for our sake, for the world's sake, for sinner's sake. And so now, what is the symbol of the cross? It's not, it's it it's not symbolizing violence and destruction, it's symbolizing deliverance. And and that's what we associate it with because God's turned the tables.

SPEAKER_00 34:41

So Haman lived this life of wanting it all. He tried to monopolize the situation. His family came on board. Uh, Tyler, you and I were talking about this earlier today, where it's like the family could have talked him out of it and said, hey man, prime and ego, you've got a lot right now. Uh hold your horses. But they really they they added fuel to the fire to say, no, you can't let any weakness exist. You gotta get rid of this Mordecai, not only him, get rid of his people. And and so they took this um take-all approach, and uh the Bible says that not only Haman was put on those gallows, but his family as well. Ten sons impaled. Oh my goodness. So, yeah, just just the brutal reality there. And so Esther and Mordecai, uh, they're on the other side of it, and they they get to experience God's blessing in an incredible way. So, as people who have experienced on this side of Christ's death and resurrection, we've experienced God's blessing and uh the gift of eternal life. And so, how does that impact you um in moving from a take-all approach to blessing others with the gifts God has given you?

SPEAKER_01 36:04

Yeah, for me, it just highlights that the the ways of God are not the ways of the world. And so to have heightened discernment of um, Lord, I want to I want to more and more recognize where what your ways are. And there there continue to be, even to today, economic systems and political systems that are highly exploitative ex- what's the word exploitative? Yeah, there we go. Thank you, thank you. That's seminary mentor Zach right there coming through with the pronunciation of exploitative. Um and and like what is the way the kingdom is radical generosity, that what God has first given his all in the person of Jesus, and what was the early church marked by um irrational generosity? Um, and then that's that's what moves the the way the kingdom forward, and that's what we're called to.

SPEAKER_00 36:54

Ditto. So, gentlemen, as you look back on this message, any final takeaways?

SPEAKER_02 37:01

Yeah, for me, I would say probably two things. One would be just ensuring that I stay grateful for what God has provided, and I stop focusing more on what I don't have and am grateful for what I do have. And in the same light, but in a little different, the second piece would be uh looking. I I've had enough instances of my life where I've had setbacks that God has used in mighty ways. And so when I'm facing something, I think for me the goal is I need to remember, remember is such a huge piece of our faith. Remember God is faithful. And though I may not see it today, and though I may never see it, I'm gonna trust because God's done it enough in scripture and in my life that uh he's gonna use this in some way, shape, or form. And so I can keep moving forward and uh believing that God's gonna do something great, doesn't have to slow me down, don't have to like lose my faith or disassociate with Jesus or anything. I I can I can trust because I I can look back and remember how good God has been. So that's that's some of my takeaway.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

Amen. Peter, I believe your question is is there anything else I'm taking beyond Sunday? Yeah, yeah.

Radical Generosity And Closing Takeaways

SPEAKER_01 38:15

There you go. Shout out to the title. Um for me, it's just simple of um trusting God is always worth it. And I the pride pride will tell me I I I can control the situation or I can control um what what what I should know or should be seeing. It's like, nope, God's got this. I'm I belong to Him, I can trust Him.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Excellent. What about you? What am I taking beyond Sunday? Yes, yeah, yeah. I think um God has given me a wealth of riches, and um the least of which is materialistic things and how to keep eyes up to notice the people around me, and when injustice comes, it won't last forever, and God has the final word. That's good. I don't have to fix it, I don't have to be the savior. He sent one, Jesus did it. So with all these things, we can take them beyond Sunday and we ought to because they shape our identity. Tyler, Zach, good having you everybody. Great having you on today, Peter. Hey listeners, thanks so much for trying saved together. Ready? You go and I'll I'll I'll follow you. Thanks for listening to Beyond.

SPEAKER_02 39:38

Come on, Tyler, Sunday.

SPEAKER_01 39:41

Let's keep living our faith beyond Sunday.

SPEAKER_00 39:42

Let's keep living our faith beyond Sunday. Dina, good luck on uh complete home makeover. Bye.